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josephine la version francaise (long version)

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Re: josephine la version francaise (long version)

Post by andrew fischer »

Lilybee, it's the USA NLTOW version (4.17) by Geffen records. Very rare.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-MYOa8Rq_Go - this is longer video version of that one you can hear on 2001 "very best of'' compilation (3.36). I've got a shorter version of this wonderful video, without backscene intro :(
Last edited by andrew fischer on 30 Jan 2008, 17:56, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: josephine la version francaise (long version)

Post by andrew fischer »

If I do get it right:

Version 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NVp6e3BwGEM
USA NLTOW release 1988,
Version 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eM4jxHfOit4
Extended french re-record / La vesion francaice lounge, Snow 1987
Version 3: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_EaCc9OfXN0
Video version (1986???), The Very Best of 2001
Version 4: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9BKKaa2hKKw
single edition 1985, CD version of Shamrock Diaries
Version 5: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VrigtWizX7c
UK NLTOW release 1988
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Re: josephine la version francaise (long version)

Post by lilybee »

Thank you Andrew! This is very helpful. (Whenever I hear his old songs I try to recall the year.)

Lily :)
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Re: josephine la version francaise (long version)

Post by ronald »

I figured it out, i had to play some vinyl though:

Version 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NVp6e3BwGEM
USA NLTOW release 1988,
Version 2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eM4jxHfOit4
Extended french re-record / La vesion francaice lounge, Snow 1987
Version 3: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_EaCc9OfXN0
Single version 1985 (edit-remix) (also best of 2001)
Version 4: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9BKKaa2hKKw
album version 1985 (vinyl only, or on germany only 'herzklopfen')
Version 5: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VrigtWizX7c
UK NLTOW release 1988

To add to the confusion, the dutch single featured the album version as A-side and the remix version as B-side.
Last edited by ronald on 31 Jan 2008, 14:48, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: josephine la version francaise (long version)

Post by ronald »

andrew fischer wrote: Questions are:
- Is the 3.45 version really that version so called french re-record (a bit reduced)?
- Is the 3.35 version that one which's used in video clip?
- What's on the B-Side - Album 4.26 version, longer version of Dancing Shoes (never heard about it), or both them?
- Which version is used on italian release?
- Does anybody know something about other vinyl single releases? What about 12'' singles? I don't remember,unfortunately...
- no, the 3.45 and 3.35 versions are the same
-that is the 3.45 (remix) single version
-depends on the release, different B-sides on releases from diferent countries
-the regular 3.45 single (remix) version
-there may some 'extended' version, i'm sure of an extended 'french' version, for the rest i have to look into this
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Re: josephine la version francaise (long version)

Post by ronald »

andrew fischer wrote:Lilybee, it's the USA NLTOW version (4.17) by Geffen records. Very rare.
Thanks for the info, I obviously overlooked that version!
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Re: josephine la version francaise (long version)

Post by andrew fischer »

Thanks a lot, Ronald! I also checked it up playing my vilyls at home.

Surely, first I was wrong, Version 4 is definitely the shortened album version (4.26 to 3.50) for a single edition.
In single edition grand piano solo is reduced.

Now I see that the video version from The Best of 2001 WAS released as a vinyl single (B-Side remix of MAG280AA). But on my vinyl single (MAG280) the shortened version of french re-record (3.45) is put!!! So that by 1985 there had been already 4 or 5 versions of Josephine (long album version 4.26, its shortened single edit 3.50, video version 3.53, its shoretened single remix 3.36, and french remix (shortened on my single - 3.45 instead of 3.55 on Shamrock CD). Don't think that vinyl single was released in 1987, as you say CD Shamrock was released).

But you say: "- no, the 3.45 and 3.35 versions are the same". How can it be? !
"-that is the 3.45 (remix) single version". I mean the video version 3.35, now I see it's definitely this.
"-depends on the release, different B-sides on releases from diferent countries" It's true, but I'm sure there's no longer version of Dancing Shoes except live edits. On this single release 3.35 remix is on A while full album version is on B.
"-there may some 'extended' version" I never heard of any extended version but french 5.35. I'll try to skip records info to find an answer.

Again, thank you very much! That's amazing experience to find out the story throughout.
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Re: josephine la version francaise (long version)

Post by Chris »

I'd like to congratulate both Andrew and Ronald on their joint research job.
At least we all know now which "Josephine" is which and what album each version was first published.
Thank you for your efforts.
Chris
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Re: josephine la version francaise (long version)

Post by ronald »

andrew fischer wrote: Surely, first I was wrong, Version 4 is definitely the shortened album version (4.26 to 3.50) for a single edition.
In single edition grand piano solo is reduced.
Album version is accompanied by a acoustic guitar, single (re-mix) version not.
andrew fischer wrote:Now I see that the video version from The Best of 2001 WAS released as a vinyl single (B-Side remix of MAG280AA). But on my vinyl single (MAG280) the shortened version of french re-record (3.45) is put!!!
On my copy of MAG280AA the re-mix version is A-side, album version as B-side
andrew fischer wrote:So that by 1985 there had been already 4 or 5 versions of Josephine (long album version 4.26, its shortened single edit 3.50, video version 3.53, its shoretened single remix 3.36, and french remix (shortened on my single - 3.45 instead of 3.55 on Shamrock CD).
There is no difference between the so called video version (3' 53"), single edit (3' 50") and the shortened one (3' 36") other than the different playing times mentioned on sleeves etc. These are all the same single (re-mix) version
andrew fischer wrote:Don't think that vinyl single was released in 1987, as you say CD Shamrock was released).
The french pressings 711 007 and 712 007 are copyright dated 1987 on the record label, CD's weren't released right away back in 1985.
andrew fischer wrote:"-there may some 'extended' version" I never heard of any extended version but french 5.35. I'll try to skip records info to find an answer.
As stated on the label of 712 007:

A1 Josephine (ext. version) (5'35")
A2 Josephine (7" version) (3'54") (this version ended up on the CD of shamrock diaries)
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Re: josephine la version francaise (long version)

Post by andrew fischer »

"Album version is accompanied by a acoustic guitar, single (re-mix) version not."
The remix (video) version - surely not. But then where does the shortened 3.50 acoustic version come from? I still consider it's from any single release.

"(MAG280) the shortened version of french re-record (3.45) is put!!!"
It's true! If you say it belongs to 1987 recordings, then probably it's a kind of re-release. My copy comes from Germany, not france, and release date is not mentioned definitely :(

"On my copy of MAG280AA the re-mix version is A-side, album version as B-side"
Of course, you're right, my mistake. Sorry :)

"There is no difference between the so called video version (3' 53"), single edit (3' 50") and the shortened one (3' 36") other than the different playing times mentioned on sleeves etc. These are all the same single (re-mix) version"

At least they're really different in time running, not in case of playing speed. In my variant, 3.50 version is reduced acoustic.

"CD's weren't released right away back in 1985"
Probably, not everywhere?... I'll check up what's copyright date of my CD.

"As stated on the label of 712 007:

A1 Josephine (ext. version) (5'35")
A2 Josephine (7" version) (3'54") (this version ended up on the CD of shamrock diaries)"

Is it a 12'' release, or CDS?

Ha, what a pretty puzzle! :)
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Re: josephine la version francaise (long version)

Post by lilybee »

I wonder if Chris Rea himself ever reads these posts... :D :D :D
You think?

Lily
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Re: josephine la version francaise (long version)

Post by ronald »

andrew fischer wrote:"CD's weren't released right away back in 1985"
Probably, not everywhere?... I'll check up what's copyright date of my CD.
I guess it'll be 1985, but pay attention to the different producers of track 4 (josephine)
andrew fischer wrote:"As stated on the label of 712 007:

A1 Josephine (ext. version) (5'35")
A2 Josephine (7" version) (3'54") (this version ended up on the CD of shamrock diaries)"
Is it a 12'' release, or CDS?
711 007 is 7"
712 007 is 12
andrew fischer wrote:Ha, what a pretty puzzle! :)
You're right there :lol:
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Re: josephine la version francaise (long version)

Post by andrew fischer »

I looked through my mp3 rare REAcordings and while comparing it with vinyl recordings found that:

The mp3 copy of vilyl single of 1985 (titled "edit -7"remix 1985", time running 3.45) while being played in Musicmatch Jukebox(TM) become named "Josephine'87" (!!!!!!!). It turned out to be the same tune to those used on french versions (5.35 & 3.55) from 711 007 / 712 007 singles of 1987. BUT it really is on my 1985 vinyl single!
Recordings signed as "short version" and "fast mix" (3.55) are both the same french version, which ended up on CD Shamrock. AND it's exactly the same "edit -7"remix 1985" of mine except 10 seconds acoustic intro very close to 4.26 version's starting.

SO: in my variant versions "edit -7"remix 1985" (3.45), "short version" and "fast mix" (3.55) used on CD and 711 007 single (aka french re-record), Extended French Re-Record (5.35) use the same tune with different time running (different beginning, same ending).

BUT: it's obvious that in 1985 two another versions were released single-edited: " Josephine (Remix)" (3:35), aka reduced video version used on The Best of 2001, and album 4.26 version.
Moreover, I still can't find out where does reduced acoustic album version (3.50) come from.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VrigtWizX7c In my mp3 collection it's mentioned as sampled by Superfunk (!!!), but it's mistake with no doubt.

There's still one question: was the version used on Shamrock CD recorded in 1985 or later?
And how many versions were released on different single editions in 1985?
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Re: josephine la version francaise (long version)

Post by ronald »

andrew fischer wrote:BUT it really is on my 1985 vinyl single!
If you're referring to the MAG280 A-side version you're wrong. That is most definetely not the same as the version as on the 711 007 single. Furthermore relying on online MP3 referrers is in my opinion not reliable. I do have all these records at home and I can definetely assure you that the 3:35 (on the italian release and MAG280AA) AND 3:45 versions are really the same The 4:26 is the original album (LP) version, (only released in Holland as A-side), the 3:55 version is the short 'french version' and the 5:35 is long 'french' version. Apart form the 'new light through old windows version, this is it.

The only confusion can result from the fact that the 1985 12" version has the same playing time as the 1987 short 'french' version... (3:55)
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Re: josephine la version francaise (long version)

Post by andrew fischer »

Thanks really a lot, Ronald!
Now that I clearly see and do understand, that french short version belongs to 1987 recordigngs while edit-remix 7'' (both 3.35 & 3.45 as you say) is the tune used in video.

BUT: where does the short french version reduced to 3.45 on earth come from?!!! If not from MAG280 as I was sure, then where?! It's not a sample surely!

MAG280: A: Josephine (3:45)
B: Dancing shoes (3:37)

MAG280AA Red:A: Josephine (Remix) (3:35)
B: (Album version)(4:26)

Are both A-sides the same as you say?....

"If you're referring to the MAG280 A-side version you're wrong. That is most definetely not the same as the version as on the 711 007 single."
It's NOT DEFINITELY THE SAME. It's shortened to 3.45, intro's reduced.

"relying on online MP3 referrers is in my opinion not reliable"
It's this bug which showed me it's from 1987. But in facts you're right.

"The only confusion can result from the fact that the 1985 12" version has the same playing time as the 1987 short 'french' version... (3:55)"
What version are you speaking about? Is it full-length video version (my 3.53) or shortened acoustic (my 3.50)?
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